X-E2 in LZ discussions tips and style (specific to X-E2 file)


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Photonoxx
X-E2 in LZ discussions tips and style (specific to X-E2 file)

Hi, 

since there's not already a thread which speak about X-E2 RAT and demosaicing, I open these one where X-E2 owner could speak about their matter and about solution they founds...

LZ most of the time get very nice results with X-E RAF file, not exactly as the embed jpeg, but sufficiently close to, but sometimes, I get very far result from the jpeg, but I not yet determine what does cause this... Is anyone experienced the same behavior ?

 

One other thing, I found constantly the LZ result  when open a RAF file is a bit too magenta or something like this. It's particulary visible on orange/yellow parts of a picture. I create this style which fix almost this matter, it consist in a hue/saturation tool with these settings :

hue : +6

saturation : +30

Vibrance : -30 

could you tell me if you find too this style get better colors with X-E2 RAF (compared to embed camera preview color) and why not with other Fuji X camera with the same sensor like X-T1 ? 

 

Here is the style content, but it's may be easier to set the above values

<Template version="8">
  <Scale Factor="0.25243112"/>
  <Image path=""/>
  <Controls>
    <GenericOperation Active="true" Collapsed="true" Locked="false" Mode="Normal" Name="Raw Color Tone" Opacity="100" OperationType="Hue/Saturation V3" layerControlsIndex="0" regionsInverted="false">
      <ColorSelection HueBlue="0.5" HueEnabled="true" HueGreen="0.5" HueRadius="-1.0" HueRed="0.5" Inverted="false" LuminosityEnabled="true" LuminosityLower="0.0" LuminosityLowerFeather="0.0" LuminosityUpper="1.0" LuminosityUpperFeather="0.0"/>
      <Slider Hue="6.0" Luminosity="0.0" Saturation="30.0" Vibrance="-30.0"/>
      <Checkbox/>
      <Choice/>
    </GenericOperation>
    <Region/>
   <Crop Angle="0.0"/>
  </Controls>
</Template>

/p

Photonoxx
I investigate a bit more

I investigate a bit more about the times LZ give a very far results compared to in camera jpeg.

 

It appears it could be linked to the dynamic range increase mode used.

In fact, many Fuji X camera offers three DR mode DR100 DR200 DR400.  It seems to work as following :

for exemple, I took a case where I shoot at 800 iso :

If I use DR100 mode, I get a normal ISO 800 file.

If I use DR 200 I get an ISO 400 file underexposed by 1 stop (because the aperture and shutter speed are the same) and a +1 stop digitally applied to lightup the picture except the highlights

If I use DR 800  I get an ISO 200 file underexposed by 2 stop (because the aperture and shutter speed are the same) and a +2 stop digitally applied to lightup the picture except the highlights

 

But LZ is not "aware" of that, and pictures that use DR200 or DR400 looks underexposed where RAW processor like LR, Photoninja or the Fuji's Silkypix version detect that and applies different Raw Tone curve.

 

It would be great if there's a possibility to have at less 3 differents RAT in LZ (perfect would be to auto detect wich DR mode is set).

 

I'd tried to create additionnal style, to correct that, and I'll try to post styles here when I'll be at home.

tomphillpotts
Using X-T1 RAT file for X-E2

Hello,

I have a Fujifilm X-E2 also and I'm experimenting with Lightzone. I've not tried much RAW processing before. I'm running Linux which can make things more tricky.

 

I am using someone else's X-T1 RAT file in Lightzone as the 'camera default', because the X-E2 has the same X-Trans CMOS II sensor. I downloaded it here from fujix-forum:

http://www.fujix-forum.com/index.php/topic/23271-lightzone-raw-converter...

 

I haven't really noticed any magenta problem that you speak of.

 

I sometimes use DR mode but since reading more about RAW processing I don't bother with it any more, as I can do it later to greater effect with the RAW file. Also if a RAW file is taken at a suitable ISO setting then DR could be applied afterwards using the in-camera RAW processor.

 

Photonoxx
I don't know if you're aware

I don't know if you're aware LZ already embeded its Raw Tone Curve for X-E2 which works pretty well.

 

For the magenta cast, in fact it doesn't seems to be as strong as I think at the beginning.

 

For the DR... In fact You can't change the DR setting of the RAW file, and with the in-camera RAW processing, you only can go down in the DR setting  :if you take photo at DR400, you can develop as if it was in DR200 or DR100, but if you take at DR100, you only can get DR100 photos.

 

DR help you to recover highlights details by decreasing ISO sensibility by 1 ou 2 stop while the shutter speed is maintained. In fact you get an underexposed picture which is lighten by 1 or 2 stops for the midtones and shadows.

 

One easy way to get a style for DR200 adjustement style in LZ, is to set a hue/saturation tool with luminosity value of 100, and add a Luminosity selection with a feathering for the Highlights.

Photonoxx
Alternate RTC for X-E2

Alternate RTC for X-E2

After a few number of problematic RAF files, I notice the default X-E2 Raw Tone Curve tend to give some color banding in some color gradient.

 

I try to tweak it to resolve the matter, and it could be nice, after testing it to replace the actual RTC by one of these one :

 

The first one come directly from the original one with just some tweaks.

<Template version="8">
  <Scale Factor="0.21515398"/>
  <Image path=""/>
  <Controls>
    <ZoneOperation Active="true" Collapsed="true" Locked="true" Mode="Normal" Name="RAW Tone Curve" Opacity="100" layerControlsIndex="0" regionsInverted="false" scale="0">
      <ColorSelection HueBlue="0.5" HueEnabled="true" HueGreen="0.5" HueRadius="-1.0" HueRed="0.5" Inverted="false" LuminosityEnabled="true" LuminosityLower="0.0" LuminosityLowerFeather="0.0" LuminosityUpper="1.0" LuminosityUpperFeather="0.0"/>
      <Points Size="16">
        <Point X="1" Y="0.07964601769911504"/>
        <Point X="2" Y="0.15486725663716813"/>
        <Point X="3" Y="0.2345132743362832"/>
        <Point X="4" Y="0.3141592920353982"/>
        <Point X="5" Y="0.39823008849557523"/>
        <Point X="6" Y="0.4690265486725664"/>
        <Point X="7" Y="0.5353982300884956"/>
        <Point X="8" Y="0.60372"/>
        <Point X="9" Y="0.6791"/>
        <Point X="10" Y="0.7433628318584071"/>
        <Point X="11" Y="0.80869"/>
        <Point X="12" Y="0.87716"/>
        <Point X="13" Y="0.93521"/>
        <Point X="14" Y="0.98355"/>
        <Point X="15" Y="0.99178"/>
      </Points>
    </ZoneOperation>
    <Region/>
  <Crop Angle="0.0"/>
  </Controls>
</Template>

 

The second one come from the RTC I've done before there's one in LZ.

The result is very close, but with far less ZoneLockers.

 

<Template version="8">
  <Scale Factor="0.21515398"/>
  <Image path=""/>
  <Controls>
    <ZoneOperation Active="true" Collapsed="true" Locked="true" Mode="Normal" Name="RAW Tone curve" Opacity="100" layerControlsIndex="0" regionsInverted="false" scale="0">
      <ColorSelection HueBlue="0.5" HueEnabled="true" HueGreen="0.5" HueRadius="-1.0" HueRed="0.5" Inverted="false" LuminosityEnabled="true" LuminosityLower="0.0" LuminosityLowerFeather="0.0" LuminosityUpper="1.0" LuminosityUpperFeather="0.0"/>
      <Points Size="16">
        <Point X="4" Y="0.2920353982300885"/>
        <Point X="8" Y="0.6061946902654868"/>
        <Point X="9" Y="0.672566371681416"/>
        <Point X="10" Y="0.7389380530973452"/>
        <Point X="11" Y="0.8008849557522124"/>
        <Point X="12" Y="0.8672566371681416"/>
        <Point X="13" Y="0.9424778761061947"/>
        <Point X="14" Y="0.9734513274336283"/>
        <Point X="15" Y="0.9867256637168141"/>
        <Point X="16" Y="1.0"/>
      </Points>
    </ZoneOperation>
    <Region/>
  <Crop Angle="0.0"/>
  </Controls>
</Template>

 

The last one, is a variant of the second one, but give more possibility of highlights recovering without having to reduce the exposure in RAW adjustement tool.

It's not destined to be a default RTC, but I found it usefull and simple (very few ZoneLockers for a result very close to default RTC except for highlight)

 

<Template version="8">
  <Scale Factor="0.21515398"/>
  <Image path=""/>
  <Controls>
    <ZoneOperation Active="true" Collapsed="true" Locked="true" Mode="Normal" Name="RAW Tone curve" Opacity="100" layerControlsIndex="0" regionsInverted="false" scale="0">
      <ColorSelection HueBlue="0.5" HueEnabled="true" HueGreen="0.5" HueRadius="-1.0" HueRed="0.5" Inverted="false" LuminosityEnabled="true" LuminosityLower="0.0" LuminosityLowerFeather="0.0" LuminosityUpper="1.0" LuminosityUpperFeather="0.0"/>
      <Points Size="16">
        <Point X="4" Y="0.2920353982300885"/>
        <Point X="8" Y="0.6061946902654868"/>
        <Point X="9" Y="0.668141592920354"/>
        <Point X="10" Y="0.7389380530973452"/>
        <Point X="11" Y="0.8053097345132744"/>
        <Point X="12" Y="0.8495575221238938"/>
      </Points>
    </ZoneOperation>
    <Region/>
    <Crop>
      <UpperLeft X="0.0" Y="0.0"/>
      <UpperRight X="3296.0" Y="0.0"/>
      <LowerLeft X="0.0" Y="4936.0"/>
      <LowerRight X="3296.0" Y="4936.0"/>
    </Crop>
  </Controls>
</Template>

Photonoxx
I post comparison samples :

I post comparison samples :

Original default RTC (notice the rainbowed gradient above the doors)

First modified RTC

Second modified RTC (slightly darker)

 

tomphillpotts
Hi, Thanks for posting these

Hi, Thanks for posting these comparisons. Very interesting. I will try using your modified X-E2 RTC's. I just have to read how to bring them into lightzone, ha ha. I will use the guide.

hofnaar
like you wrote here on my own

like you wrote here on my own profile where you got mor deep black tones: http://lightzoneproject.org/lorum/fuji-x-e2-raw-tone-curve-profile

is that problem with bending colors also there? let me know. maybe we can find a way to make a great xtrans profile together :)

Photonoxx
I already try your RTC, and

I already try your RTC, and if I remember well, there's no color problem with it (may be I'll redo the test to be sure).

Photonoxx
For those who are interrested

For those who are interrested, Lightzone seems to open RAF files from the new X-T10 Fuji X camera.

 

Obviously, there's no Raw Tone Curve, but the X-E2 above or the already exisiting X-T1 ones works pretty well (the captor and electronic are mainly the same in these camera), so You can use them by downloading them or open an X-E2 or X-T1 RAF file and create a style with just the original RTC for these camera.

caniloup
Fujifilm X-E2 RAF

Hello,

After Fuji's firmware update to version 4.0, Lightzone apparently does not longer open the RAF files created by Fujifilm X-E2.

Is there anyone with an idea how to fix this?

Wolf

 

Photonoxx
Hi, 

Hi, 

 

I didn't notice this yet, but as I don't make many photos actually, may be I didn't yet work on post v4 fw RAF file...

 

I'll do some test this evening when back to home.

 

Additionnally, which version of lightzone do you use on which OS ?

caniloup
Hello Photonoxx

Hello Photonoxx

Sorry for my late reply, I was offline for some days.

I'm using Lightzone Version 4.1.5 running on Windows 7.

 

Wolf

Photonoxx
Sorry for my late reply too..

Sorry for my late reply too...

 

Just test and I can confirm there's a matter with a LZRAWtmp file (involving a PPM file).

Here is a sample file if some people want to test it.

 

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BytzA2YKF1rJRGhCNWcyRGJCR1k/view?usp=sh...

 

May be it's DCRaw linked (probably LZ 4.1.5  was released priori to X-E2 fw 4.00 update) ?

Jacal
Darktable 2.0.4 - but not 2.0

Darktable 2.0.4 - but not 2.0.0 - can handle your file, so can latest RawTherapee. I think there are good chances it will work with next LightZone version with updated dcraw.

(And, by the way, the room on your picture looks like it was designed by a talented cat!)

Photonoxx
Thanks about the "talented

Thanks about the "talented cat designed room" comment ! ;)

 

About the matter, it seems to be what I suspected, but I'd not tested yet with other software.